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#1 Dec 28 2012 at 11:17 PM Rating: Good
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I've been off from work all week, and I've taking the opportunity to watch a ****-ton of awful movies on Netflix. Recently, I've been watching Chinese kung fu movies with Donnie Yen, who's a spiritual successor of sorts to Bruce Lee (same fighting style, plays the same character in a sequel to one of Lee's movies, etc.). The movies are mediocre, mostly due to sins committed in the editing room, but there's been one thing that really stuck out for me: the overwhelming amount of xenophobia in every movie against the Japanese, English and Americans. In every movie, the Japanese are depicted as imperialist, arrogant pricks, and the English and Americans are always cowards, blowhards, and complicit with the evil Japanese plot.

I'm trying to think of the Hollywood equivalents to these flicks (Bruce Willis movies?), and whether or not they're laced with American xenophobia as well. Try as I might, I just can't find it. I don't know if it's there and I just don't notice it, if I'm not seeing the right movies, or if the Chinese are really that ****** at the other world superpowers.
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#2 Dec 29 2012 at 5:38 AM Rating: Good
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Demea wrote:
I've been off from work all week, and I've taking the opportunity to watch a sh*t-ton of awful movies on Netflix. Recently, I've been watching Chinese kung fu movies with Donnie Yen, who's a spiritual successor of sorts to Bruce Lee (same fighting style, plays the same character in a sequel to one of Lee's movies, etc.). The movies are mediocre, mostly due to sins committed in the editing room, but there's been one thing that really stuck out for me: the overwhelming amount of xenophobia in every movie against the Japanese, English and Americans. In every movie, the Japanese are depicted as imperialist, arrogant pricks, and the English and Americans are always cowards, blowhards, and complicit with the evil Japanese plot.

I'm trying to think of the Hollywood equivalents to these flicks (Bruce Willis movies?), and whether or not they're laced with American xenophobia as well. Try as I might, I just can't find it. I don't know if it's there and I just don't notice it, if I'm not seeing the right movies, or if the Chinese are really that sh*tty at the other world superpowers.


You mean like... Hollywood movies where the bad guy is either Chinese, Russian, or German? [sarcasm] No, those don't exist at all [/sarcasm]
American bad guys: Russians, Germans, even Chinese or Korean. Now of course they throw in the middle easterners on occasion.

Movie bad guys seem to reflect those that have been real bad guys to the audience. Germans and Russians being a big one for the US audience, acting in their stereotypical ways. It's not really that big of a surprise that, given the bad blood between the Chinese and Japanese, and the relationship between the US and the Japanese, that Chinese audiences would be given evil Japanese bad guys and accepting American lackeys.

Edited, Dec 29th 2012 6:43am by TirithRR
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#3 Dec 29 2012 at 6:08 AM Rating: Good
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Demea wrote:
or if the Chinese are really that sh*tty at the other world superpowers.

The Chinese really, really hate the Japanese. That'll happen when you kill a few hundred thousand people, though to be fair, that's a really small percentage of the Chinese population.
#4 Dec 29 2012 at 9:18 AM Rating: Good
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Allegory wrote:
Demea wrote:
or if the Chinese are really that sh*tty at the other world superpowers.

The Chinese really, really hate the Japanese. That'll happen when you kill a few hundred thousand people, though to be fair, that's a really small percentage of the Chinese population.
You know, I remember learning all sorts of stuff about the ***** in school, but I don't think I ever really learned about Nanking in a classroom. I don't know if it's just the public schools in my city or state, or if it's glossed over in most classrooms in the States. Maybe it's different now, maybe I'm misremembering, but I'd bet a large portion of Americans don't really know what anybody except the ***** did in WW2.

Edited, Dec 29th 2012 10:19am by Spoonless
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#5 Dec 29 2012 at 9:25 AM Rating: Excellent
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Spoonless wrote:
Maybe it's different now, maybe I'm misremembering, but I'd bet a large portion of Americans don't really know what anybody except the ***** did in WW2.
And Pearl Harbor.
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#6 Dec 29 2012 at 9:33 AM Rating: Good
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The One and Only Poldaran wrote:
Spoonless wrote:
Maybe it's different now, maybe I'm misremembering, but I'd bet a large portion of Americans don't really know what anybody except the ***** did in WW2.
And Pearl Harbor.
Right.
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#7 Dec 29 2012 at 11:31 AM Rating: Excellent
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I tried to watch Ip Man, but the jingoism, when added to the usual kung fu goofiness, made for a really bad pairing. The movie alternated between comical, trite, and dull.

I'm not surprised by the flavor of nationalism that those movies have. China's got a long history of other countries overtly trying to get their claws into it, so one expects their perspective to be colored by that knowledge, sometimes in spite of reason.

We've always had our own issues with this stuff, even if they're perhaps a little less pronounced right now.
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#8 Dec 29 2012 at 11:34 AM Rating: Good
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A jingo ate my baby!
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#9 Dec 29 2012 at 11:41 AM Rating: Good
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Spoonless wrote:
A jingo ate my baby!

Screenshot
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#10 Dec 29 2012 at 11:49 AM Rating: Good
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A bunch of good examples.

As a general rule, stuff like this exists (and often succeeds) because it's reaffirming a world-view. It's a result of the Confirmation Bias. It's employed to reinforce Chinese perception of imperialist jerks, just as we use it to laugh at the Chinese guy from The Hangover's small *****.
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#11 Dec 29 2012 at 12:03 PM Rating: Good
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Jesus ****, did that really need a separate page for each ******* paragraph? I hate that ****. So much. The actual "article" itself takes up less than 25% of each page. Put the comments at the end of the whole thing; there's no real reason to have them displayed on every page.

And it's not just the site you linked. This is how almost every site does these kinds of articles. It's ********* It's terrible page layout design. It makes me want to punch small children.
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#12 Dec 29 2012 at 12:16 PM Rating: Excellent
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Spoonless wrote:
Jesus @#%^, did that really need a separate page for each @#%^ing paragraph? I hate that sh*t. So much. The actual "article" itself takes up less than 25% of each page. Put the comments at the end of the whole thing; there's no real reason to have them displayed on every page.

And it's not just the site you linked. This is how almost every site does these kinds of articles. It's bullsh*t. It's terrible page layout design. It makes me want to punch small children.


The more pages people have to click through, the more ads are seen and page hits are gained. Trust me, web designers are on your side on this one.
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#13 Dec 29 2012 at 1:34 PM Rating: Good
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Shaowstrike the Shady wrote:
Spoonless wrote:
Jesus @#%^, did that really need a separate page for each @#%^ing paragraph? I hate that sh*t. So much. The actual "article" itself takes up less than 25% of each page. Put the comments at the end of the whole thing; there's no real reason to have them displayed on every page.

And it's not just the site you linked. This is how almost every site does these kinds of articles. It's bullsh*t. It's terrible page layout design. It makes me want to punch small children.


The more pages people have to click through, the more ads are seen and page hits are gained. Trust me, web designers are on your side on this one.


Aye, it's terrible to look at, but the logic behind it is cruelly on-point.
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#14 Dec 29 2012 at 1:39 PM Rating: Good
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Eske Esquire wrote:
Shaowstrike the Shady wrote:
Spoonless wrote:
Jesus @#%^, did that really need a separate page for each @#%^ing paragraph? I hate that sh*t. So much. The actual "article" itself takes up less than 25% of each page. Put the comments at the end of the whole thing; there's no real reason to have them displayed on every page.

And it's not just the site you linked. This is how almost every site does these kinds of articles. It's bullsh*t. It's terrible page layout design. It makes me want to punch small children.


The more pages people have to click through, the more ads are seen and page hits are gained. Trust me, web designers are on your side on this one.


Aye, it's terrible to look at, but the logic behind it is cruelly on-point.


Terrible to look at? What resolution do you run? I'm at 1680x1050 and I read all 50 entries and didn't see the comments at all, the article filled the screen, the next button was visible on that screen. If it weren't for the scroll bar I wouldn't have even known there was a comment section on each page.
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#15 Dec 29 2012 at 3:55 PM Rating: Good
Ip Man is pretty fantastic. It kind or reminds me of Unforgiven. The first couple of Ong Bak movies also have some nifty Kung Fu. I guess the 3rd one does too, but the plot ******* blows. The Protector is definately Tony Jaa's best though, as it has this scene;



Yup, single take. It took months to train the ******* cameraman!
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#16 Dec 29 2012 at 3:55 PM Rating: Good
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TirithRR wrote:
Eske Esquire wrote:
Shaowstrike the Shady wrote:
Spoonless wrote:
Jesus @#%^, did that really need a separate page for each @#%^ing paragraph? I hate that sh*t. So much. The actual "article" itself takes up less than 25% of each page. Put the comments at the end of the whole thing; there's no real reason to have them displayed on every page.

And it's not just the site you linked. This is how almost every site does these kinds of articles. It's bullsh*t. It's terrible page layout design. It makes me want to punch small children.


The more pages people have to click through, the more ads are seen and page hits are gained. Trust me, web designers are on your side on this one.


Aye, it's terrible to look at, but the logic behind it is cruelly on-point.


Terrible to look at? What resolution do you run? I'm at 1680x1050 and I read all 50 entries and didn't see the comments at all, the article filled the screen, the next button was visible on that screen. If it weren't for the scroll bar I wouldn't have even known there was a comment section on each page.


Eh? I was just speaking generally to the "one entry on each page"-type articles. Most of 'em don't have a "view all" option, so you have to click through each one.

I don't know how the article filled your screen, though. The writing isn't more than a couple of sentences for each entry - most of the page is filled with a huge image, and the ad/link miscellanea. It's poor design by pretty much all standards, except the ones related to making money.

Edited, Dec 29th 2012 4:57pm by Eske
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#17 Dec 29 2012 at 4:00 PM Rating: Good
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Omegavegeta wrote:
Ip Man is pretty fantastic. It kind or reminds me of Unforgiven. The first couple of Ong Bak movies also have some nifty Kung Fu. I guess the 3rd one does too, but the plot @#%^ing blows. The Protector is definately Tony Jaa's best though, as it has this scene;



Yup, single take. It took months to train the @#%^ing cameraman!


Jaa performs a version of Muay Thai, not Kung Fu. Smiley: schooled

The Protector is awesome, though. Gimme my damned elephant.
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#18 Dec 29 2012 at 4:01 PM Rating: Good
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Omegavegeta wrote:
The first couple of Ong Bak movies also have some nifty Muay Thai


Smiley: oyvey


This was the best fight scene in the entire movie.



Edited, Dec 29th 2012 5:06pm by Shaowstrike
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#19 Dec 29 2012 at 8:34 PM Rating: Good
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Eske Esquire wrote:
I don't know how the article filled your screen, though. The writing isn't more than a couple of sentences for each entry - most of the page is filled with a huge image, and the ad/link miscellanea. It's poor design by pretty much all standards, except the ones related to making money.


I meant vertically. Since the big complaint was that the comments were on EVERY page, but you never saw them if you just clicked the "next" arrow and viewed the image and paragraph about the film. It makes it very easy to go through each entry, just click the "next" arrow and the next image and snippet appears. No scrolling, nothing. I'd much rather have it in this "gallery" type view than have to scroll down constantly through 50 entries.

http://oi46.tinypic.com/243izpj.jpg
http://oi49.tinypic.com/19em8.jpg

See, each time you click the "next" arrow everything loads up the entry in the proper orientation, all you see is the title, image, paragraph, ready to click the next or previous. It's not really a poor design.

Edited, Dec 29th 2012 9:48pm by TirithRR
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#20 Dec 30 2012 at 9:12 AM Rating: Good
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Eske Esquire wrote:
Omegavegeta wrote:
Ip Man is pretty fantastic. It kind or reminds me of Unforgiven. The first couple of Ong Bak movies also have some nifty Kung Fu. I guess the 3rd one does too, but the plot @#%^ing blows. The Protector is definately Tony Jaa's best though, as it has this scene;



Yup, single take. It took months to train the @#%^ing cameraman!


Jaa performs a version of Muay Thai, not Kung Fu. Smiley: schooled

The Protector is awesome, though. Gimme my damned elephant.

Watched the first Ong Bak last night. Muay Thai is kind of sweet, all flying knees and elbows and spinning kicks to the face. Plus, in regards to the OP, the bad guys in the movie were also Thai (except for a foul-mannered Australian who looked like Slash on steroids), so there was less of the paranoid isolationism from all the Chinese movies.

Also, Ip Man was pretty sweet. However, like Rocky 3, Rocky 4 and Rocky 5 before it, the sequel was the same exact plot, down to the letter, with a different bad guy. Very disappointing.
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#21 Dec 30 2012 at 1:34 PM Rating: Good
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Demea wrote:
Watched the first Ong Bak last night. Muay Thai is kind of sweet, all flying knees and elbows and spinning kicks to the face.


Muay Thai was the martial art that got me into MMA. It always struck me as more ruthlessly efficient than the other traditional types (whether that's true or not). It strikes me as more concentrated, too, like there's less focus on building up an ******* of moves, and more focus on mastering a smaller set of useful ones. I like how heavy the kicks are, and elbows and knees seem to serve better than punches, at least for me.

It's a main staple of most MMA training for a reason, I'd say. Not that drunken monkey or whatnot isn't cool in it's own right, of course.
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#22 Dec 30 2012 at 1:57 PM Rating: Good
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MMA = Train with Muay Thai, then resort to sweaty man on man hugging and fisting in actual combat.
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#23 Dec 30 2012 at 2:11 PM Rating: Excellent
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Shaowstrike the Shady wrote:
MMA = Train with Muay Thai, then resort to sweaty man on man hugging and fisting in actual combat.


Casual homophobia aside, that's not always true. Though personally, I actually enjoy the wrestling/BJJ side of things more than any of the standup game. When you learn even a little about it, you realize that it's a chess match - the ground game is where the greatest separation is between those who've studied it, and those who haven't (there's very little "puncher's chance").

I know I'm snapping at you when you're just being flippant, but it's a personal pet peeve of mine. I get annoyed when people denigrate it offhand, especially when they do so by bashing gays. You'd be surprised at how many otherwise liberal-minded folk will get uncomfortable with MMA when it goes to the ground.

Quite a derail we've got here!

Edited, Dec 30th 2012 3:17pm by Eske
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#24 Dec 30 2012 at 4:52 PM Rating: Good
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Shaowstrike the Shady wrote:
MMA = Train with Muay Thai, then resort to sweaty man on man hugging and fisting in actual combat.

Phrasing... Smiley: oyvey
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#25 Dec 30 2012 at 5:04 PM Rating: Good
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Pretty sure it was intentional.
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