Regain Moonshade Earring is the most underrated melee item Follow

80% haste would like to say hi? As far as I know, a single buffer (Brd99/Rdm49) can easily send most well-geared DD to haste cap these days, especially a DRK with Last Resort...

If your math is right, it would take 10.6 seconds to swing a scythe 6 times at 80% haste. You would have earned a whole 3 tick with the regain earring during that time.

That being said, unless you're dual wielding, I think the regain earring is pretty decent (Especially when idling out of range or something). Brutal + Regain. I have a harder time seeing it on a DW class: Suppanomimi and Brutal would beat it any day of the week.

If it lowers you a hit on X-hit its great, otherwise it is garbage

In most situations, as fast as you should be swinging, it will only give you a couple TP at most, and most competent DD are going to have a gear set that will allow them to get a 6-hit or a 5-hit (if they're two-handed, and if they're single handed they're likely dual-wielding, thus shouldn't be using a Moonshade anyway) on their own without factoring in something random like a 1tp/tic regain. The TP Bonus Moonshade earring though is going to, for the most part, be the best earring for weaponskills, since it adds quite a bit to weaponskills that are Damage varies with TP as well as Chance of Critical Hit varies with TP.

It's better to go with something that is certain to help you do more damage with your weaponskills than something that might (but shouldn't if you gear properly) help you weaponskill sooner.

If it was active all of the time, I'd probably have made it.

The fact it works the way it does is what made me decide to make it a refresh earring instead.

/shrug

Edit: never mind, Vlor's post answered my question pretty much.

Edited, Apr 24th 2012 3:52pm by Subadai

Chiming in that Suppi + Brutal > pretty much anything else for the DW set, even at 99.

Probably some of the last level 75 cap gear anyone ought still be wearing.

If rose strap is the only piece of store TP they're wearing, then yes, they're doing it wrong. but 10 STP is a pretty sh*tty amount of STP, though it does still push a couple of 2h weapons up a hit tier, iirc. Store TP is a pretty huge offensive stat for 2h weapons (not so much for 1h/h2h, though it can still help). Also, Moonshade Earring has a static max TP gain which is lower than a decent Store TP build will give. MSE cannot exceed 20TP/minute, while store TP can, and does so very easily. Let's use your 528 delay scythe as an example.

528 delay; bases: 14.4TP/hit, 8.8 seconds/swing, 6 Hits/Minute, 86.4 net TP gain, before accuracy, multiple-attack effects, and being hit.
Now, let's say you spend 5 minutes engaged. Over 5 minutes, MSE will give you 100 TP, or 1 free WS
This Scythe starts with a natural 7hit, a 6 hit requires a minimum of 16.7 TP/hit, which this scythe achieves with a very minuscule 16 STP, and a 5 hit 20 TP/hit, which needs 39 STP
/sam gives a natural 15 STP, while /war gives a natural 10% double attack, both of which will increase your TP gain significantly (I don't know which more drks sub, but my numbers have drk/war stomping all over drk/sam, so I'm just going to do /war. Besides, Zanshin is a pain in the ass to account for.), and ignoring the possiblity of a cor giving sam roll, since there are better choices most of the time,
Drk/war: needs 16 STP for a 6hit and 39 STP for a 5hit; 6hit is easy, 5hit may be trickier; is the Store TP magian scythe worth getting over the WS damage/TP bonus ones?

Capped Gear or JA haste (25%) and no other haste, 25%; 396 delay; thus
6.6 seconds/swing, and 9 hits/minute
7 hit over 5 minutes with Regain, 15% double attack and 95% hit rate:
48 hits at 14.4 TP/hit; 691.2 TP +100 TP; 791.2 TP = 7 WS
6 hit over 5 minutes, no Regain, 15% double attack and 95% hit rate:
48 hits at 16.7 TP/hit; 801.6 TP = 8 WS
5 hit over 5 minutes, no Regain, 15% double attack and 95% hit rate:
48 hits at 20.0 TP/hit; 960 TP = 9 WS

Capped Gear or JA haste (25%) and the haste spell, 40% haste; 316.8 delay; thus
~ 5.2(66...) seconds/swing, and 11 hits/minute;
7 hit over 5 minutes with Regain, 15% double attack and 95% hit rate:
59 hits at 14.4 TP/hit; 849.6 TP +100 TP; 949.6 TP = 9 WS
6 hit over 5 minutes, no Regain, 15% double attack and 95% hit rate:
59 hits at 16.7 TP/hit; 985.3 TP = 9 WS (Note that the net TP gain is still higher with only +16 STP, at 27.1 TP/min, compared to MSE's 20.0TP/min)
5 hit over 5 minutes, no Regain, 15% double attack and 95% hit rate:
59 hits at 20.0 TP/hit; 1180.0 TP = 11 WS

Capped Gear and JA haste (so 50%) and the haste spell (15%), so 65% haste; 528 -> 184.8 delay, thus:
~3.06(66...) seconds/swing and 20 hits/minute (Unless I'm remembering where the decimal truncates wrong, in which case it would be 19 hits/minute, but I'm going to favor lazy rounding and not bother to check, because this is a cleaner number, and 5 hits won't change the ultimate outcome, it should just lower the net WS by 1 across the board)
7 hit over 5 minutes with Regain, 15% double attack and 95% hit rate:
109 hits at 14.4 TP/hit; 1569.6 TP +100 TP; 1669.6 TP = 16 WS
6 hit over 5 minutes, no Regain, 15% double attack and 95% hit rate:
109 hits at 16.7 TP/hit; 1820.3 TP = 18 WS
5 hit over 5 minutes, no Regain, 15% double attack and 95% hit rate:
109 hits at 20.0 TP/hit; 2180.0 TP = 21 WS

Capped Haste, 80% haste; 105.6 delay; thus
~1.7(5) seconds/swing, and 35 hits/minute (Again, unless I'm remembering wrong, in which case 34 hits/minute. Just gonna do the same thing here as I did before.)
7 hit over 5 minutes with Regain, 15% double attack and 95% hit rate:
190 hits at 14.4 TP/hit; 2736.0 TP +100 TP; 2836.0 TP = 28 WS
6 hit over 5 minutes, no Regain, 15% double attack and 95% hit rate:
190 hits at 16.7 TP/hit; 3173.0 TP = 31 WS
5 hit over 5 minutes, no Regain, 15% double attack and 95% hit rate:
190 hits at 20.0 TP/hit; 3800.0 TP = 38 WS

So, as you can see, The more haste you have, the more valuable Store TP becomes, and the less damage MSE will add to your overall amount, because MSE will only ever add 1 extra WS every 5 minutes, no more, no less, while Store TP can do that and more.



Haste spell is 15%, but magic haste caps at 43.5%, you're forgetting double march. I don't remember what the caps are for marches, but iirc, double march was around 22-23% haste last time I did the math so double march + haste is ~37% haste, while SV double march will cap your magic haste alone. Gear haste and JA haste (Hasso, Haste Samba, and Desperate Blows; Blitzer's roll is separate) cap at 25% each, and total haste caps at 80% unless you're using h2h (technically, h2h and martial arts, but if you're using h2h and don't have martial arts, wtf are you doing? lol480baseh2hdelay), or dual wielding, the technical haste cap goes down because the cap isn't so much a "haste cap" as it is a "delay floor". Also note that MA/DW/Blitzer's Roll (the other delay reducer) are not additive with haste, they're multiplicative, so outside of ludicrously high amounts, the haste cap is still going to be near 80% (The lowest haste cap I've found was with every single piece of DW gear at the time, which was like, 65ish% haste cap, but it's been a while, I might crunch it out and edit this for the sake of my own curiosity).

Being overly kind to MSE was my point, because even being overly kind it was still clearly inferior to store TP. That and I really couldn't be bothered to be more accurate when fudging it like I did got the same end result. without making any of the details necessarily wrong, just best case scenario.

There isn't any Save TP aug... only TP bonus +25, and that "Occ. grants dmg. bonus based on TP +5%" thing which I'm assuming is trash.

Wouldn't one of the only reason to use regain earring right now would be to double as a slow-as-hell pseudo meditate? Assuming there's any monster at all in range, drawing your weapon will let some TP trickle in while you wait for people or stuff (Like triggers, or a dragon landing or whatever else I can't think of)

Of course, you'd probably be better making a WS-enhancing earring, but assuming for some reason you're still holding on the regain one, I guess I'd put it in a macro when I'm backward-tanking or something like that?

===
Also, Jinte, when you added march, you probably should consider that bards are essentially running soul voice march 50% of the time these days. By that, I mean that Marcato + Troubadour gives a ~5 minutes double-potency Victory March on a 10-minute cooldown.

With +3 instrument and Empy+2 gloves, that would be 40% Haste: Marcato Victory 29% Haste (10.5% at 600 skill, +3% for instrument, +1% for gloves, times two for Marcato) + Advancing 11% Haste (7% cap, +3% for instrument, +1% for gloves)

That's assuming I'm not miscalculating anything from the wiki -- I didn't actually go ahead and calculate the exact haste my ninja gets from my dual-box Brd/Rdm.

Edited, Apr 25th 2012 8:51pm by Docent42

Aww, now I'm feeling all bad that I went with regain moonshade (with ratt) since I have nothing else to wear when playing around on rng.

For 1h jobs, this is the answer. For 2h jobs, see the many posts above. H2H users are the oddballs where Brutal/Moonshade Regain really is the best DoT option. But even then, people using the earring solely for MNK may go with Counter.

Another use... I idle and buff in Regain gear on COR (Moonshade, Roller's Ring, Tactician's Roll as much as I can) when I'm running around buffing people. That's 7tp/tic with an XI Tactician's Roll active. Just engage on the mob while you're doing your buffing and you gain an extra 1tp/tic even when not actively shooting/meleeing.

So for me with MNK PUP COR NIN DNC THF, regain earring is a really useful one. I use it for TP gear on PUP/MNK, idle gear on COR, and I simply ignore it for NIN/DNC/THF and use Suppa+Brutal instead.

Not sure what merit ws or empys you have for those jobs but a tp bonus 25 would be the best ear for stringing pummel, VSmite, Hi, evis, rudras, last stand. Depending on what ws you merited and empys you might have, you might get far more benefit than an idle piece for cor. Basically if most of your ws are damage varies or crit rate varies then tp bonus is glued to ear for ws. May want to inventory your ws. Can prob use it on more than 3jobs that way.

I'm actually on vaca so just phone. Can't avess my spreadsheets and stuff. I won't be able to give a full blown comparison but can probably ball park it close enough later tonight. Mostly just depends on the crit rate anchors at 200/300tp to determine crit rate. For drakes I think its 3.75% crit rate. Toss on the 4atk and its hawt. I'm not sure what crit tiers for pummel are off the top of my head, but if its similar it should remain good as well. I'll look at it later

For Mnk/Pup, TP bonus won't top regain, because;




Well, for h2h ws, Asuran fists gets nothing useful from 25% TP bonus, because it's an acc varies with TP ws (95% capped hit rate gives you a 65% chance to land all 8 hits of asuran. Doesn't get any better.), and Shijin Spiral, is the best WS for mnks who don't have VS, and pups who don't have VS or SP (It's competitive with SP, which is Competitive with VS, for pups anyway, they're all about the same, each taking the lead in different situations, but none clearly superior) has its Plague effect duration based on TP, so offensively, it gets nothing from the TP bonus earring, either. Ascetic's Fury is mostly garbage outside of abyssea, though I'm not really up to date on how much impetus helps it compete elsewhere, so I may be off there, but it's 15%/25%/45% according to BGwiki (FFXIclopedia's better for guides and sh*t, but BGwiki has much more accurate numbers, for those who weren't aware), for SP, I'm not really sure. Byrth's testing had it as a 35% crit rate at 100% TP, which seems all sorts of too high on paper, compared to the other crit ws, but based on my own experience with pup, doesn't seem totally unlikely, either, because SP does typically have a fairly high crit rate at 100% even outside of abyssea. Either way, though, it still won't really be able to top regain for pup, because pup actually somewhat exacerbates mnk's slow WS rate issue, since it's 2 MA traits, and thus 40 base delay, slower than mnk. Mind, you, I say somewhat because depending on the situation, pup can make up the difference and keep pace with mnk's TP gain, if not slightly outpace it, with judicious and liberal use of Tactical Switch. I've never bothered to math it out, but I might in a few minutes, and if I do, I'll edit this post with what I find, for those who are curious.

Well that changes things. I was just going by you job list. If you are willing to gear mnk and pup at the expense of other jobs then go fir it. The tp bonus is just a dilemma like suppa. Its pretty universal as the right choice. But if all you play drk then abyss is the best but so narrow in focus and suppa has ubiquitous use. I'm not trying to say get tp bonus for mnk (even noted not to), just that it is of narrow application. Also I can't find any info on pummels crit anchors so no math today.

But if you focus on mnk/pup more powa to you.

Edited, Apr 28th 2012 6:21pm by Banalaty

Someone really needs to get on testing those, and I might have to suck it up and do it myself next time I decide to resub, which may be this month because I'm bored as @#%^ and FFXI is the most interesting-sounding MMO atm (Burned myself out for Rift, EVE, CoH, and hell, even @#%^ing minecraft. For a while, anyway. )

I opted for the regain for my mnk/pup because by the time I finished the missions to get get the earring, BST got ruinator. the tp bonus is not a big deal for ruinator.


oh, and the last WotG battle is a cinch for solo bst.

It doesn't proc on weaponskills (that's essentially impossible anyway). It is double damage at 300% TP. It's overall worthless.

Edited, May 4th 2012 8:44am by Neisan

There's better TP earrings (unless you are under the effect of amnesia, and I highly doubt people are making builds specifically for being at 300 TP under amnesia), and TP bonus and other options are better WS earrings. And yes I said it's most likely impossible as all TP is expended when you use a WS, that's why Blau Dolch is active during WS, you have 0 TP when it fires (possibly exception being sekkanoki, so if it did work... it would be once every 5 minutes for 200TP damage boost which isn't even double and only if you started at 300 TP when you used sekkanoki... if it did work it's far too situational over just getting TP bonus for many useful weaponskills or regain for pup/mnk).


Edited, May 4th 2012 11:41am by Neisan